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S3 E18: F*ck it, Mask Off


ICP Logo

S3 E18: F*ck it, Mask Off





On the tenth anniversary of the Trial Lawyers Summit, The National Trial Lawyers’ most sought after event, and one of the most popular conferences for lawyers and legal industry business in the year, took place from May 4th to 7th in Miami and In Camara Podcast was there to tell you all about it.

After 14 long months since we last covered a live legal conference, we got our masks, our branded swag, and what is left of our in-person skills and ventured to Miami Beach to spend a week in the company of other lawyers and legal professionals to get caught up in how our world has changed since we all last met.

From the newcomers to the oldtimers, the unexpected to the surprising, this conversation looks at the things that stood out but most importantly about how it felt to be back to somewhere that feels more familiar than the pandemic lives we have been living this past 14 months.

Send us your questions at ask@incamerapodcast.com

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Liel: [00:00:00] After 14 months without in-person legal conferences, last week, from May 4th to the 7th, the Trial Lawyers Summit took place in Miami Beach. I’m Liel Levy, co-founder of  Nanato Media, and this is In Camera podcast where we put on our masks and headed their.

Liel: [00:00:47] Welcome to In Camera podcast private legal marketing conversations. Grace, you’re here right next to me.

Grace: [00:00:54] We are sitting next to each other for the first time forever.

Liel: [00:00:57] Yes, this is the masc-off episode of In Camera podcast

Grace: [00:01:03] With Six Feet Apart.

Liel: [00:01:04] Yeah, kind of, but have taken a lot of precaution. And we are here at national trial lawyers. Right. And when we say we are here at national trial lawyers, it means that this event took place like the previous week because you’re going to be listening this with a few days of a delay. But we’re recording live, and it’s very exciting because it’s day number three. The summit finishes up tomorrow and it’s just been a wild ride, right? I mean, it’s been three very intense days. A lot of things have gone on, but it’s been great. It’s been I mean, it’s been full of great vibes and energy and fun conversations and also a little bit of wake up to reality, don’t you think, Grace?

Grace: [00:01:50] It was I think I heard a lot of people saying I’m out of conference shape.

Liel: [00:01:55] Yeah. In my experience, it’s really hit me hard. The whole idea of being back in front of prospect clients or even existing clients. Grace, like meeting them, seeing them again, getting personal, having these conversations that are not happening through Zoom, that didn’t flow as seamlessly as I thought it would like my first three interactions with people coming by our booth where just… I couldn’t articulate

Grace: [00:02:21] Out of practice.

Liel: [00:02:22] Yeah.

Grace: [00:02:23] And happens. And I think, you know, seeing each other in person for the first time in over a year, over a year is hard.

Liel: [00:02:29] So here’s where I think it it it became it was different. Is that over the past year. Everything that’s been business interactions, they’ve been organized right, Zoom meetings are planned ahead of time. You prepare, you know who you’re going to be talking to. You have kind of like an agenda, maybe even a written agenda. And it’s very structured now from there to just all of the sudden be face to face with a person and just starting a conversation from nothing about what and for how long just felt like, you know, um, I don’t know how to do this.

Grace: [00:03:09] Yeah, it has been a while and definitely an unusual feeling to have people come back up to the booth finally again and talking to them about everything we’re doing. It’s  definitely unusual.

Liel: [00:03:20] It is Grace. It is. But at the same time, we’ll get into it in a moment because you had you guys had so much going on, all of your activities surrounding the summit. But it’s that feeling, that feeling of gratification that a lot of things that you’ve been walking almost for the past 12 months, 13 months, 14 months, to finally share it with them, you know, in-person and put them in light for everyone to see and to appreciate. And like, for instance, in our case, it’s our book and it’s just so gratifying. Right. It gives you that although it’s not released yet, the fact that we can announce it. Right. And you can do it in person and you can actually talk about it, it’s just such a feeling of gratification that makes you forget about all of the difficulties that came with putting it together.

Grace: [00:04:08] It really does. I think being here is a culmination of a lot of things for a lot of us and everybody that you saw their faces, it was like being out of a cage for everyone.

Liel: [00:04:18] Totally.

Grace: [00:04:18] So I do feel the same as you. I feel like that sense of gratification in everything that’s been going on. I mean, even our last conversation about branding. Right? I mean, that all came together at the shell for me. That’s right. That’s really good.

Liel: [00:04:32] That’s right. Exactly. What was a conversation about preparing for this moment? And it actually, I think we’re safe to say at this point, it paid off and big-time.

Liel: [00:04:41] All right.

Liel: [00:04:42]  So to Grace for those who were not in attendance at National Trial Lawyers Summit in Miami. What did they miss happening in persist booth.

Grace: [00:04:53] They missed a lot. I mean, from day one to now, right. Even at this moment, right now downstairs, if you’re not here at the Lowes at downstairs, we have to Porsche race cars that are actually going to be a part of a raffle in terms of you get to experience ride along with these two race car drivers in Porsche GT four, and they’re all part of an entire series racing. It’s like extremely cool. And that’s today.

Liel: [00:05:20] Oh, wow. That even surprised me. I had no idea I did see the race cars, they are amazing. Oh, my God. They’re amazing.

Grace: [00:05:27] They’re logoed and branded with our logo and the persist group logo. And then that was just today again yesterday. You know, I know Liel saw this. There was an insane line of people at our booth. Why? Because we had Danica Patrick there.

Liel: [00:05:44] I must say that I did not know who Danica Patrick was until Grace told me that she got invited to persist booth during the conference. And when I read about her accomplishments, her achievements, I mean, I was blown away. What an inspirational person she is. And then yesterday when I met her because I was lucky enough to actually get my picture taken with her, what a sweet and lovely lady she is. Quite an experience. And so I hear everyone else who had an opportunity to either take care of his or her picture with her and chat with her, have the same things to say. 

Grace: [00:06:26] Yes. Thank you. It was Ed’s idea. As a matter of fact, you know, those who don’t know Edward Lake, you know, Esquire is my CEO and he definitely put all his I mean, he put all out for this one, for NTL, for National Trial Lawyers. We went all out and it honestly, for me, felt like it paid off, you know, between the branding and the events that we put together and the cars. And, you know, we’re persistent. Yeah, that’s the idea.

Liel: [00:06:51] So I’ll be very honest with you, Grace, like from a participant standpoint, is it 100 percent came through like you guys were one hundred percent visible at all times, like there was plenty of persist stuff. There’s plenty of giveaways, there’s plenty of visibility of the brand. And there was a good level of awareness about all of the different little things you had happening around. Little, not so little. And so I think, you know, when you consider, because this is a reality, it’s not just persist here. They’re not the only sponsor of the event. There’s so many other people going around and everybody has their agenda and everybody wants a slice of the cake. I think you guys did a pretty good job in sticking out.

Grace: [00:07:37] We carved out our piece for sure.

Liel: [00:07:39] Yeah, yeah, I would call it a quarter of a cake, but you can call it a slice if you want. And so that’s kind of like the event itself. Grace, there’s been so many receptions, gatherings. There are people who are attending for the first time. Right. We are in that both. We would not we’ve known the national trial lawyers. We’ve actually covered it. Last year we had an episode about National Trial Lawyer Summit. But this is as Nanato Media, the first time that we’re actually participating here. And you know what, Grace? I’m pretty impressed by, you know, the commitment that NTL has to this summit, the effort that they put behind curating the program, you know, complying and being in compliance with all of the restrictions and regulations and like, just put themselves through these really, really extra work just to make this happen. I think also paid off because I think people are having a blast.

Grace: [00:08:44] I agree with you wholeheartedly. I mean, besides being out of the cage for the first time in forever, you know, everyone’s going to be happy about that. Secondly, it’s in Miami. How can you not be happy? Right. I mean, these Miami Beach hotels, beautiful. But I mean, the breakfast, honestly, the breakfast has been the best breakfast I’ve seen at any national trial lawyers. Right. They really put it all out. They put their effort into it, the flow of the booths.

Liel: [00:09:09] So, OK, so this is this is a quick parenthesis here. We’re going to shift the conversation towards hospitality and quality as a whole, just ramen, because, you know, these are the things that you want to know about. Right? You’re going you’re coming to a conference. You’re paying good money. Right. And, you know, your meals are included during the conference times. You don’t have a lot of time to actually go and eat outside or somewhere else. So you want to know that you’re going to be treated nice meals. And did they deliver? They deliver an amazing product Grace. I’m going to tell you, like even at the bars, they’re serving as mixers like fever tree, which is like never before seen on a banqueting event. High end, super high end. Yeah, super high-end. I mean, super top-notch. No, no tip jars on the bars. No, no tip jar in the bar, which just comes to show. Right. About how committed everything is and the fact that also, you know, trial lawyers, summit organizers went all out. Right. And the sponsors. Right. Because all of these special events, all of these cocktail hours or so are actually made possible because companies sponsor them. And honestly, all of those who did, I think it’s a great branding exercise. I got to know a lot of brands I did not know about that they are in this same industry selling different services than we do, some of them with some similarities.

Liel: [00:10:36] But it’s just interesting. It’s good also to know what your competitors are doing and people who work in the same industry. How they do that. I mean, great. If you would ask me what has been the best conversations or the ones that I’ve enjoyed the most are the ones that I find potentially more gratifying, I think have been those where they are about like how this past year has been for you. Talk about the business cycle, how things started and how then things turn around and, you know, when was the scariest period for you and then realized that you were not the only one. Right. Like, I think a lot of those for a very long time have been kind of holding the fort in the sense that we want to come across strong. We want to keep the guard up. Right. Because we’re still in a fragile environment. And it was nice to be able to have conversations with people where we’re kind of like that guard like or if you may say like the mask came off in another non-lethal way. Right. Right. And that was I mean, I’ve had some very heartfelt conversations with some people that I care about. And so it was very gratifying.

Grace: [00:11:45] Yeah, you’re right. I mean, you know, I actually got to do a little bit of a presentation on a panel with Seth as the moderator.

Liel: [00:11:52] That’s true. Just now, Grace coming hot out of the stage.

Grace: [00:11:56] That’s right. That’s right. So with Seth, he was the moderator, right, from Price Bennowitz and then Ken Hardison and Jay from FileVine. And it was the first time I’ve done this with Jay from FileVine, but it was not the first time with Seth and Ken, you know, as, you know, Liel

Liel: [00:12:13] Family for you.

Grace: [00:12:14] Yeah. And so it was extremely gratifying to feel like I was one bringing in someone else to our, like, little group unfold with Jay from FileVine and also, you know, being able to have these conversations again in person with each other and just feed off the energy of what’s been happening like you said, and how can we make things better again? You know, I mean, even with. Everything that’s going on or how or because of everything that’s going on. What are we going to do to make things better? And that’s kind of, you know, part of what my conversation was with them. But like to your point, those were the most gratifying conversations were with people that I know, like and trust and haven’t been able to really see in such a long time. So that felt good.

Liel: [00:12:57] And not to mention any names, but I mean, one of the things that we were just talking about before we came on air was that apparently because we were not in the room, but apparently one of the speakers today was a single person on stage with a PowerPoint presentation, reading out slides. And I think Grace I think we both agree this is not what we came for here. We’ve had a year full of people showing slides on one small window, talking to a screen where nobody else could talk. I think what’s the real value of being here at this event? Are these panels. The panels are amazing. It’s conversations. They’re live. They’re you know, they’re unscripted and they’re and they just start with one thing and one idea and then evolve into something completely unrelated. It has happened so many times. I’ve had so many conversations where they had to recapitulate what was the actual question at the beginning because the comparisons are completely derailed. But doesn’t matter. It’s wonderful. It’s wonderful. Right, because that’s the spontaneity that I think we were all missing and that that just doesn’t translate over Zoom that well. And it’s a magic that doesn’t happen when you’re you know unless you’re actually sitting next to your panelists. right next to you watching them in the eye. Right. Just like this conversation, Grace,

Grace: [00:14:17] We feed off each other.

Liel: [00:14:18] Oh, yeah.

Grace: [00:14:19] It’s the same when you’re in person. You can feel the energy, the vibe about everything around you and including your audience. Right. Like for us right now, we’re you know, we’re sitting in the middle of the hallway with people walking past us. You know, they’re staring at us and we’re staring at them. But it’s fun, you know, to get back into this type of atmosphere, feeling and like you said, panels with real conversations back and forth. It’s been too long.

Liel: [00:14:40] Yeah. We need to add them to the episode notes, credits, like all of the people who were passing by while we were recording. We thank you. And we would mention you if we knew your name, but we don’t. So we were just going to thank you. I think, Grace, that’s been really the magic of this event. And if you were to ask me, you know, it’s not about take away so much here in this conference. I think it’s more about what have been the winners. Right. And for me, winners are these being in front of people and interact. And whether, you know, some of those conversations, you then go over them in your mind and just say, oh, I wish I would have stayed on or thought of things in a slightly different way, but wasn’t sharp enough, fluent enough, ready for it. Right. I think that’s great. I mean, to me, it has completely shifted my mindset into a different place. And literally, this is this happens over on the first day, like my mind went from being in one place, which. OK, it’s good, right? Very organized, very structured, and such. And then he took me to a more spontaneous or less rehearsed, more human, I would say. Right. And I love that. I’m enjoying that a lot. That’s my big winner right now, here. What is one of your favorite things, Grace?

Grace: [00:16:03] Actually, it’s going to sound funny, but it was two things. One was the food,

Liel: [00:16:09] The food and the drinks are winner. So 100 percent, 100 percent Grace.

Grace: [00:16:15] So besides the food, I actually really enjoyed some of the business of law tracks. I didn’t get to listen to too many, but I saw the ones that were, you know, obviously well attended. And some of them were people that I know quite well and one that you know, and that was Michael Morse from his fireproof.

Liel: [00:16:31] I was there as well.

Grace: [00:16:32] Yeah. 

Liel: [00:16:32] Were you sitting inside?

Grace: [00:16:33] I didn’t get to sit in. I literally stuck my head in for like two minutes because, you know, I know him. We know him. Yeah. And so it was really nice to see that one, you know, and finally have him in person at one of these shows giving his speech, you know, fireproof that you and I did a podcast a while back on, you know, so that to me, you know, some of those business of law tracks, I feel like a lot of these lawyers, some of them even started during COVID, you know, like solo-preneurs or some brand new lawyers I was talking to quite a few of them, it is surprising. So they’re struggling. They were struggling because they don’t know a lot of the vendors. They don’t know a lot of the events and people that these things normally happen. But they did this time.

Liel: [00:17:16] Ok, sorry, you guys have to apologize for that.

Grace: [00:17:19] You’re going to hear music now on.

Liel: [00:17:20] Uninvited soundtrack in the back, but it is what it is. That’s what you get with live event recordings. But Grace you’re saying

Grace: [00:17:30] We get to hear about the national trial lawyers they’re announcing behind us. 

Liel: [00:17:34] That’s right. That’s right.

Grace: [00:17:35] So for me, it was the business of law tracks. So being able to teach everybody what they needed to know and not being able to learn from all the vendors and other lawyers. Right. They have so much to teach each other in person is really hard for most people. Yeah. So I think that was probably my favorite was being able to talk to people and really help them help themselves. Yeah.

Liel: [00:17:57] 100 percent. And that kind of takes me back to the conversations, to what I said about the conversations that I had with people that were more specific about what last year looked like. How did you go through it? How did you felt? And so some of the panels that I’ve heard were actually about that, about they spoke and talked about her journey over this past year. Right. I think the power of that is that, you know, the pandemic is something that everybody can relate to. It impacted everyone. And everybody went through that. And it’s very different. Right. When you hear the story of someone who’s just, you know, telling you about how they started, how they grew, how they scaled, and that’s inspiring as well. But when you hear it in the perspective or in the time frame that you can understand like that, you know, where you were before and you know where you are now and you can hear somebody’s journey and somebody’s achievements during that same time frame that you can actually almost kind of like draw a parallel line about what was there, where were you during that time that it has learned for a very powerful contrast, right. For people to be able to see, you know, maybe I could have done more or you know what? I’m so glad that I did what I did because I see myself with these other people are.

Grace: [00:19:19] It’s hard to benchmark when you don’t have anybody to talk to.

Liel: [00:19:22] Correct. And not only not always the case. So you also hear things that unfortunately just didn’t go well. There’s a lot of stories of things that did not survive the pandemic. And so I think those conversations business of law, great. I couldn’t attend many of them, but the ones that I was either in attendance or partially attended. Great. Grace, I have one more winner for me. It’s been getting to meet in person for the first time, many of our guests here at In Camera podcast. And not only yeah, it’s not only that, it’s great because it’s someone that came gave us very valuable time, shared with us a lot of incredible insights to be able to actually thank them in person and get to have a conversation also with them in person. But it was also about, you know, how much these episodes have meant for other people that have been able to get to know them through this podcast and through these episodes. Right. Because at the end of the day, it’s that’s what we do this right because we’re creating content that is helping other people. And so while we may not always get to hear direct feedback on them, we can see how many people have been going back and listening and how many people are downloading. And so it’s very rewarding. Right, when you can also share this information with your guests and tell them, hey, you know, one of your podcasts is on our top five most downloaded podcasts. So I think that’s always something you like to share. Right. You don’t want to send it over email because it’s like a stat. You don’t want to send a report. But when you can get it said as part of a conversation, it’s, um. Yeah, yeah. That’s a great feeling. It’s a great feeling. And one we should also be very proud of because it’s our podcast.

Grace: [00:21:12] Yes, it is. And it’s exciting. I mean, even at the end of I don’t know if you heard my. Oh no, you didn’t get a chance to. So at the end of my speech, I definitely threw us in there. And I said I know for those of you that now, you know, you need to create content and content that people care about. And, you know, I always talk about we always talk about three takeaways at the end of our hour In Camera podcast. And that’s how I took the conversation. And at the end, they said, I am going to give you three actionable takeaways that you can take right back with you right now. And this is what you need to do. So, yeah, I mean, I was able to throw in the In Camera podcast on there and, you know, being able to thank the people in person and see them and just interact again. I mean, it just feels so good. I mean, even just sitting here next to you, I mean, having this conversation, it feels so wild. It really does.

Liel: [00:22:01] Yeah. Yeah. And I think that’s one of you know, it reminds me a little bit of a conversation that we had with Ali Katz not too long ago where she completely turned around a perspective on why the. The pandemic in Kobe, 19, has been, and you should say something that, you know, come across a little bit as controversial as saying, well, covid-19 was a gift. Right? When you stand here in this position in which we are, you realize how lucky we are. Right. And it gives you an extra maybe two or three layers of appreciation of what’s happening and how not to take for granted nothing. Right. Because the fact that we’re here right now doesn’t mean that we’re done. We’re out of it and we’re not. And, you know, we’re going to be back at a lot of events next month. Hopefully this is the case, but it may not be right. And so that that sensibility that we have now towards that and that I’m not taking for granted anything, I think it’s also a lot of what’s creating the vibe and really. Nice atmosphere here.

Grace: [00:23:15] We are ready to meet. Yeah, like, I don’t think I’ve been in as many meetings ever as I have today and yesterday. It really has been insane in a good way that people are like, yes, please come let me come talk to me and tell me what you have to offer me. I’m ready to listen. I’m ready to buy. I’m ready. I’m ready. I’m ready. And I’ve not heard that in a long time.

Liel: [00:23:36] You’re absolutely right. And the other thing I experienced is like our interaction is built around. We get to know we have a quick conversation and then we end up by setting up a follow-up conversation, at which point we, you know, we have an iPad and people just go all the time and all that stuff. Right. And so it has worked brilliantly in all of the shows that we did in the past. Pre-COVID I think of it this time, like everything, the whole system still works very well until we come to the point of getting to the iPod and talking and scheduling and setting up the room. Nobody wants to do it and nobody wants to do everybody. Everybody wants to, you know, keep the conversations in person, want to keep the interaction without. Yeah. Without actually getting into getting some piece of technology underway.

Grace: [00:24:27] They don’t want to do many. What they don’t

Liel: [00:24:29] Want

Grace: [00:24:29] They don’t like. I’m here. Talk to me right now. I had someone tell me that they said, you know, I’m not to be rude or anything, but I’m here. I want you to talk to me right now about this. Now it is. And I was like, you know what? That’s great. I’d much rather that right close right when it’s happening.

Liel: [00:24:43] Grace, I got a person yesterday asking for a contract on the boat, on the boat, literally like and it’s one of those things that you’re not used to because it wasn’t the norm. But just things have changed.

Grace: [00:24:56] People are ready because when they know you.

Liel: [00:24:58] I think so. Yeah. I think one feeling I’m getting and I may be wrong, but one feeling I’m getting, it feels much that people are ready to start trusting people because of how they come across to them. Right. Having conversations and sold. Yeah. And then just getting yeah. Let that let the conversation, let the relationship build up organically without having to, to overthink it and ask, you know, for, for ten different files and ten different references and going check twenty reviews like I think people are ready to for and I think

Grace: [00:25:35] That will be different. You and I are a little unique in that we’ve been to this show a few times and I think that the vendors that are at this show have been here quite a few times as well. I mean, there are some new people, like you said. But, you know, the old crowd, the crowd that’s been here, they came, right? They yeah, they came this time. And so those lawyers that have been seeing us like you, you know, you’re not a media booth. And yeah, I’m persist Booth, even though now it’s completely rebranded. I feel like people are. Oh, I know you now I’m ready to really get involved because I got my stuff together over the last year and I want to buy somebody I can trust, talk to, see in person, see face to face. And now I know who the I’ve seen how many camera cars. I’ve seen him in his boots, you know.

Liel: [00:26:23] Yeah. Grace totally 100 percent. So yes, we’ve been into our shows, we’ve been to AJ and all their conferences, NTL, national trial lawyers. It’s some it’s our first one. But still, now I do want to talk about other very rewarding moments here at the conference. Those have been, in our opinion, in my opinion, like seeing people recognize this. Right. And people recognize those people that we did not meet before personally in a way. But just like we’ve been saying over the past year, like you can need to continue to market yourself. You need to continue putting content. You need to continue doing things right. And that’s something we did in our agency. That’s something that we live by. Right. And to see people coming strategically to want to talk with us that we did not know, it means a lot because these are people that have been getting to know the brand over the last year or 18 months. It doesn’t really matter, but it’s been a journey for them. And they’ve actually planned to actually come and have a conversation with us at this conference because they knew also we were going to be here. Right, because we took the effort of letting them know as well that we’re going to be here. And that’s very, very rewarding because you can see that journey not really come full circle, because this is another touchpoint, but this is a big milestone in that journey.

Grace: [00:27:51] It’s such a good point. I mean, like you said, someone to ask you for a contract at the booth. No one has ever really I mean, it’s happened maybe once to me, but I couldn’t tell you the last time. Right? Yeah. It’s just not the norm. So people are ready to just and I used the wrong word before. It’s not sold. It’s have fucking different phone conversations with each other, right. Yeah. Yeah. They’ll have conversations with each other.

Liel: [00:28:15] So that’s great. That’s 100 percent yes, I mean, it’s people are here to to to get to know people and build relationships that can lead to potential partnerships. That’s, I think, the mindset that’s I think where everybody feels

Grace: [00:28:31] Like they feel like they know us after all the stuff we put out there and tried to help everybody. And I don’t know if you get that same feeling, but I do. I feel like people. You’re your camera podcast. Oh, yeah. You’re in camera podcast. You all I remember I heard that they had a podcast that you did about X, Y, Z. You know, it really helped me out. Can you talk to me about this?

Liel: [00:28:51] That’s that’s Amazing Grace.

Grace: [00:28:53] It’s nice. It’s nice to have that happen, you know, because I feel like you said, not full circle. This is another touchpoint. But there were so many rewarding moments. It’s really hard for me to keep even talking about more and more. But, yeah, it the whole thing really felt good. Yeah.

Liel: [00:29:08] Yeah, I agree. It’s it’s just being a very sort of like feel-good event from start. We don’t know yet the end of it because we still have another evening of events and tomorrow half day. But I think you can already tell in fatigue that people having kind of yearning for for for this opportunity. I also think like people are also very humbled by it. And I also think that it’s not everything business. I also think that a lot of what’s happening right now here is people just needed it. It’s serving as a time and a place for people to unwind a bit. Right, Grace? And I can say for myself, it has given me that a little bit as well. It’s the best is the first business trip that I make pretty much since lockdown. Well, not quite, but the first long one. OK, and it has also, you know, the same effect that you get when you go on retreats or team building days. It gives you that moment also to step out of operations for a little bit. And just even there are still operations, but it’s just different from the day-to-day routine at the office. And so this actually has created an opportunity to just take a moment of breath, of reflection and ideas like I don’t know you, but for me, it’s been like idea after idea after idea. And I love that because you come here to be inspired and you and that’s what happens.

Grace: [00:30:39] Oh, my goodness. Speaking of ideas, that actually brought another idea into my head because of what we’re doing. Right. What we did with Danica Patrick. And you said it’s the feeling of being together again and everything. It’s not business only. Right. So we took, you know, a couple of pictures, obviously, with Danica Patrick and Lindsay had she’s our social media coordinator. She had a great idea to basically send out the pictures with every to everybody and also tell them, hey, if you hashtag persist group and you, you know, tag us as well and you share on LinkedIn, you know, whatever social media platform you choose, you get an extra entry to win one of the racing experiences that we’re offering as part of the whole thing. So, you know, it’s that sense of engagement and just, you know, kind of bringing it all together. I feel like it’s coalescing. That’s the good that’s the word I was looking for. I feel like everything is coalesced to this point, this moment. And it’s been beautiful.

Liel: [00:31:36] Yeah, I totally agree with you. And it’s just because things are flowing right and they feel natural and organic, that’s, you know, that’s organic. It’s there and it’s applicable. And it’s something that we kind of like a little bit lost over this past year. And it feels great to have it back. So, Grace, to wrap up things, let’s think of a few takeaways. Can we?

Grace: [00:32:02] I think so, yeah.

Liel: [00:32:03] I mean, we can do our first episode after tip and then we can not have takeaways that would be wrong. Like why would we ever do that?

Grace: [00:32:10] We have to. Yeah. And if you feel safe enough for me, this is my first takeaway. If you feel safe enough, start going to events. I mean, there’s another one coming up. Right, the PILMMA Super Summit in September, I believe.

Liel: [00:32:23] Yeah, but there is one earlier. So American Association for Justice announced their annual convention this year. This year, yes. Las Vegas, July. Yes, Grace.

Grace: [00:32:36] It’s like everyone switching up.

Liel: [00:32:37] I know it’s crazy.

Grace: [00:32:38] NTL in May. I mean, it’s hot in Florida.

Liel: [00:32:41] So, yeah, it was initially speculated that, well, speculate. I think it was actually announced that it was going to be in Chicago, but ultimately they ended up changing the venue to Vegas Cosmopolitan. So mid-July. AAJ, I guess

Grace: [00:32:58] It’s going to be brutal. Yeah, so

Liel: [00:33:02] The first thing is going for

Grace: [00:33:03] Is, wow, July, that’s insane. That’s like it’s like doing it June or July here, except maybe a little worse. So we’ll probably be there, though. I mean, prepare

Liel: [00:33:12] Prepare to not leave the air conditioning and an air conditioning that you need to wear like a jacket to survive because they don’t kid there.

Grace: [00:33:20] It’s true. It’s true. I mean, like if you come to Miami in May, you know, I don’t think a lot of people were expecting what they came into. And honestly, when you get off the plane here, it’s like a wet blanket. Yeah. So, I mean, all of these poor lawyers are walking around in long-sleeved suits and jackets and.

Liel: [00:33:36] Yeah, not a great idea Grace. But I’m loving the weather. I think it’s amazing. And like, what a treat to just be seaside.

Grace: [00:33:45] I mean all the beaches, you can see the beach right from the hotel. It’s literally behind us every day.

Liel: [00:33:51] I find myself at some points just staring at the sea for a long, indefinite period of time. And you know what? I love it. Like, I don’t I don’t need to justify it. No. To me or to nobody else. I just love it. Grace, that’s a really, really good takeaway when you’re ready. Yes. Just know that these events are here for you and they all feel good. So that’s a very good takeaway. I think another one, Grace, is don’t question your marketing decisions as long as they’re not stopping. Right. The point I think that’s one thing that we all got very reassured here was that those who kept on. So I can say that also from the vendor standpoint. Right, those who held back, I don’t think it’s fair to say that things went south, but they just they lost market share. I think it’s fair to say that at least they lost market share.

Grace: [00:34:51] No, no, you’re 100 percent right. I agree with you on that second takeaway, because you can see it, right? You see who’s here and who’s not. You see what kind of happened or didn’t happen. So, yeah, no, I definitely agree with you on this. I can take away I can have it there. Do you go for it? You know, it’s funny because I’m going to use the same takeaway one of the takeaways that I had on my speech earlier today, and that is reach out. I mean, we are all people that are here and we all know each other. Right. And most of you have heard us for at least a year, maybe longer. So I think that you need to reach out to vendors, reach out to other lawyers, reach out to your network, reach out to people that you know, that you’ve seen and heard and, you know, like and trust. Yeah, we’re here,

Liel: [00:35:35] Gres, going back to these conversations that I’ve had. And so one of the one of the nicest things somebody told me, you know, we were talking and we you know, the conversation got a little bit real, right? We were talking about the hard things, good things and everything. And I one of the things this person told me was like, well, the L like, why didn’t you reach out? Why didn’t you reach out like that? That’s what we’re here for. Right. So reach out. And it’s so it’s so reassuring. It feels so good to know. Right. And it’s something that I may have known. Right. That I thought I can do. But you’re all you’re always second guess yourself. And so this is a good reminder not to write. So take away number two. And number three are the same a little bit, but don’t have second guesses when it comes down to reaching out and find people that are going to help you get better in whatever it is that you want to get better.

Grace: [00:36:34] Exactly. Yeah. Couldn’t have said it better. And what you want to get better in because there’s always something that you want to get better and there’s always somebody out there that knows as much, if not definitely more than you, because this is their forte, you know, like in the national media and like, you know, we this is what we do for a living. So I promise you, we’re not the type that sells like that. We inform. We make, you know, like and trust because that’s who we are. And so if you don’t go with us, ask us who to go with, ask us, ask around and go to your network and just reach out.

Liel: [00:37:07] That’s absolutely right, Chris. And so with that, we come to an end of our episode, Trial Lawyer Summit 2021. But we’re going to be back next week,

Grace: [00:37:19] Next week with

Liel: [00:37:20] Not our traditional format. But still great conversations.

Grace: [00:37:23] That’s right.

Liel: [00:37:24] All right. Thank you Grace.

Grace: [00:37:25] Thank you.

Liel: [00:37:27] If you like our show, make sure you subscribe. Tell your co-workers, leave us a review, and send us your questions to ask@incamerapodcast.com. We’ll see you next week.

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